4.11.22 Notes from the first Member Board Exchange
- “Informal” format
- Board Directors are sitting on stools with microphones in front of them.
- Sue Wilson on stage Left taking notes on the computer. Marcia Johnson on stage right taking minutes for the meeting.
- Three microphones set up in the audience – one on each aisle and one in the front.
- Large screen up on stage will show the Table that Sue is typing into.
- It contains three columns: Comment/Solution/Action
- After the speaker is finished, raise our hands if we agree with the speaker.
BASIC STRUCTURE OUTLINED
After
the pledge and introductions, president Dale Lehrer welcomed us to the first Board
Member Exchange. She asked for members
to address their issue by coming to any microphone; be courteous. Offer a
solution if you have one. No clapping. No booing. Be open to compromise.
COMMITTEE PROGRESS REPORTS
She
asked the Directors if any of them had a progress report to make regarding the
committees that they chair.
Allan Lenefsky mentioned the Bylaw Ad Hoc committee was making progress.
GM
Bill Cook mentioned that the Lakes East West Maintenance project was coming
along nicely and should be completed by August. He said the issue of the color
of the building came up from interested members and after consultation with
them, the proposed gray was changed to a tan/southwestern look.
SPEAKERS - MEMBERS - CLICK ON TITLES FOR LINK TO VIDEO
A
representative from the Best Friends Dog Club read a lengthy, well-researched
paper asking for the Board to consider adding or finding space for an Indoor
Climate Controlled Space for dog training; they have been asking for this since
2019; they have already contributed 5K out of their own funds for the existing
shade structure at Fairway; would like to have this completed by their 30th
anniversary next April.
Why
is the RCSC selling golf passes to outsiders; unlimited golf, tee times.
Outside tournaments are taking precedence over the members, using courses
several times a month; Suggested raising the fee. Also recommended taking a
deep dive look at the entire golf program.
Very hot pavement in summer hurts/harms the feet; is it possible to get more pool decking put down. GM Cook remarked that they are replacing pool decking with a rubber rock. Will continue to study to see which is the better product for the longest longevity; don’t want to spend $$ on something that isn’t going to last.
Another
member said that outsiders should not be allowed to use our RCSC portal; in
order for us – the members – to use, we have to have a number.
A
suggestion was made to consider making the above into a stand-alone project; it
could bring in additional revenue. Mentioned that the American Society of
Theater Consulting recommended between $200-400 dollars per gross sq. ft. on a
new building; they also have a lot of information we could use before decisions
are made.
Would
it be possible to put the “official” slogan of Sun City – “The City of
Volunteers” on our electronic messaging boards at each center? The other slogan is rumored to have come
about from the previous GM and has no historical value. Sun City has three major Volunteer Groups –
PRIDES – formed in 1980, Posse - 1972 and the Sunshine Service since 1961 plus
every club has volunteers.
It
has come to the attention of this new resident that the dog parks do not have
any video cameras nor is any sort of ID required to enter. His dog was severely injured by someone who
appeared to have come from another community. This resident did his due diligence
and discovered the “outsider” was indeed from Glendale. The suggestion was to
purchase video cameras and get access control readers. This member has only
been here a few months but feels that the Board grossly mismanages RCSC.
Safety
of woman on golf course; asked a worker why they didn’t admonish the “gentlemen”
who were walking through the course to stay off; the employee said that they
were told to not interfere with them. Suggestion was made to call the Clubhouse
immediately when this happens.
NOISE AT LAKEVIEW with PROPOSED PLAN TO ADD PICKLEBALL COURTS
Resident
concerned about the noise that will emanate from the additional noise if 14
pickleball courts are constructed there to take the place of those a Mountain
View. The area adjacent to these courts is a quiet area; many members walk the
“hill” to the gazebo and many boaters are on the lake because they enjoy the
serenity there; the constant noise of pickleball rackets hitting balls will not
be welcomed.
A SNOWBIRD USES THIS FORUM TO CATCH UP ON WHAT HAS BEEN HAPPENING.
- The PIF – yes, it is raised to 4K.
- The Quorum was brought up at Annual Membership Meeting – where is that at? Dale said that would be addressed in the Ad Hoc Bylaw committee
- The Mountain View entire project – Bill Cook explained the process along with Dale and Sue. Design has been approved by the Board; no contractor has been chosen. They are now collecting comments from the various clubs as to particular items that those clubs want incorporated. These will be passed along to the vendor and will attempt to incorporate as many as they can.
- Attempted Recall Thing – 3 Board members; has there been any action on this? The question wasn’t answered as the member said that they should not have voted because they had a conflict of interest; the president assured everyone that they had not.
CHANGE MEETING NAME TO MEMBER BOARD EXCHANGE
Since you stated that this meeting will belong to the members, could we change the order of the name accordingly? Large showing of hands.
NOT ENOUGH TRANSPARENCY ON BIG PROJECTS
The
members are not given enough information; you need to identify milestones; it
will help cut down on questions at these meetings. Suggested hiring a Director
of Communications. Bill Cook mentioned that the new and improved monthly management
report indicting the status of the projects (Green/Yellow/Red) shows that. Discussion also ensured regarding the amount
of Carry Forward funds. Bill said it has been shown that an organization should
have 50-60% of their assets covered by reserve monies. Mike Eke asked Bill Cook
if he would consider creating a page for the website that stated milestones and
progress. Bill said it wasn’t needed;
that was what the management report was.
A
member who would like a gymnasium wanted to know how they could be sure that
said gym would be geared for 55+ age, not teenagers and how would they be notified
of an answer. Bill Cook said that they are taking that input now.
Their
membership/fees/etc. are dependent upon what the agreement was at the time it
was signed.
LACK OF TRANSPARENCY ON MOUNTAIN VIEW PROJECT
A
member mentioned that she had followed procedure and requested information regarding
the above topic but was told she couldn’t see it. Bill Cook said that they can’t
share dollar figures about projects that are still in process. Board member
Karen McAdam, speaking as a representative of the minority on the Board, said
that she reviewed the videos from five years ago but cannot find the
justification for the third phase that was brought forth and the one that got
passed. This plan has caused the most
disruption because of the absence of all the court sports as well as the mini
golf.
VOLUNTEERS OF SC; GOLF FULL PAY PASSES; IT
A member clarified why the 'official' motto should be City of Volunteers; more discussion on golf.
Questioned why the clubs who donate to various organizations have to give a matching sum to RCSC. It was stated that if your club donation is given to the Sun City Foundation, you don’t have to provide a match to RCSC. Bill Cook mentioned this was because we’re a 501C4 organization; thus all donations have to benefit the membership.
UPSET STOMACH OVER PROCEEDINGS
A newer resident/member to the community expressed disbelief that a General Manager would answer a request from a Board Director in the manner he did; reminder of who works for whom.
UNDERSTANDINGTHE PROCESS OF THIS TYPE MEETING GOING FORWARD
Wanting
to clarify what was said at the beginning: Members give input – goes into the Issues
column. The column entitled
Suggestions/Ideas come from the member who brought up the topic. In most cases,
the Actions column is empty. Who/when/where
will that be filled in? An example was given that because this meeting was
mostly input from the members, the next exchange will have the Board doing more
of the presenting as they answer the Actions column. It was asked if that is
allowed. Can Board members meet outside the Board room as a group (with a
quorum) and make decisions? Sue Wilson replied
that I had AZ Title 33 mixed up with AZ Title; the latter is where we
fall.
Would
like to verify that you do receive ALL the messages you receive even those that
are snail mailed. The correct email addresses were given.
Lack of communication from the staff to the Board to the members.
LONG RANGE PLANS FOR OAKMONT? LAKEVIEW? IS MARINETTE FINISHED?
Are
these in existence? Is there a Master
Plan in place?
AS THE MEETING CLOSED
- We were reminded to send input to the president.
Respectfully Submitted by Jean Totten, Advisory Panel, Sun City Advocates
Any errors in writing are mine.
25 comments:
Well, the first Board/Member exchange is in the books and it was not the riot fest I thought it would be, but it is early. As usual I have an opinion and I will share it. I will not respond to every point, but the ones I feel are important.
Best Friends Dog Club continuing requests for more. I personally have nothing against the dog club. My next door neighbor belonged before her two dogs crossed the Rainbow Bridge. Since unelected SCA Board member Bill Pearson likes history, here is some on the dog club. During the planning stages of Fairway, management asked the club what were their requirements for their new space. As I understand it they requested the space currently occupied with a few young trees on the east side of Fairway. Then a few years later they wanted more trees because of the heat. Then a few years later they wanted a canopy because of the heat. Now they are back again wanting indoor space. Now we have the question of where will this be? I would presume somewhere inside Fairway, but where and how many square feet and who potentially would have to give their space. Then where does the displaced relocate. Perfect example of not thinking things through.
Golf and tee times. This seems to be a perpetual problem with the gold community. I live on the South course and I formerly was a golfer (18 handicap) but the infirmities of age have caught up with me. But I digress. I have found that normally this course is empty as is the fact today.This now raises the question of a tee time, is it the tee time to play or a tee time for the only course you wish to play? I do see late in the afternoon outside players, in some instances they are members of local high school golf teams. As far as I can tell Sun City residents are not being displaced. Think about this.
Performing Arts space/center. Now we are talking about moving from MV to a stand alone building. Two questions that follow this like puppy dog, where to locate and parking. This facility has moved around more than two chess boards. They would accept MV but what about basketball in the gym. If they think that is noisy, what if the Creature From the Black Lagoon known as pickle ball wants courts marked on the floor? Then there is the member who suggested hiring a consultant who would charge $200-$400 per square foot. That would come to somewhere between $800,000 to $1.6 million based on a 4,000 square foot venue. That is before architect fees, permitting fees and cost of construction. This thing has boondoggle written al over it.
Dog bite in Duffeeland. Disclaimer, I am not an attorney and this is not legal advice. I highly suggest that the member seek formal legal advice.
A non resident brings has two dogs to Duffeeland which consequently attack and seriously injure a member’s dog thereby incurring medical bills for the dog. Is RCSC liable in this instance. No as this situation would fall under a legal theory known as assumption of risk. Another example, I stated I live on the South golf course and a golfer hits a ball that breaks one of my windows. RCSC is not liable because when purchasing I knew or should have known this would happen. The owner of the injured dog should have known this would happen in spite of the dog club which oversees Duffeeland cannot prevent all situations like this. That’s the bad news, now for the good news. The member did state that through investigation, he has the name and address of the owner of the dog(s)that attack his. We now enter an area known as tort law. Since the owner of the animals that caused the injury is responsible as it could be argued that he was negligent in supervising his animals, thereby causing the injuries. The injured party could/ should sue in Small Claims Court in Surprise for medical bills, the PI and court cost as long as the total of the original claim is under $10,000. Again I advise to speak to attorney about this. He will probably agree with essentially what I wrote.
That’s all for the moment. Have fun storming the castle.
Exceptional report Jean, you always amaze in your attention to detail. Here's an interesting footnote; there are close to 600 views since it was posted late Monday night and the email blast sent Tuesday morning. That fact alone is startling. Maybe folks are starting to take self governance more seriously. One can only hope.
Interesting comments C de P. Much of it i won't dispute, history is exactly that. Unfortunately most living here don't know how or why we got to where we are. I too have been sharing my thoughts regarding the member/board exchange on TOSC, most of which comes with a historical perspective.
I will say this regarding golf; in the past year i have been putting together the numbers regarding golf and they are self explanatory in relationship to what is going on. If we learn nothing, we should come to understand things happen for a reason. To be more precise, increasing the number of rounds played from 300,000 to 350,00 is problematic. Allowing outsiders to use our courses for less than what members pay is utter insanity. Especially when you consider we have subsidized golf from the general ledger to the tune of 25 million dollars in the last 12 years and another 50 million dollars from the PIF.
As is mentioned i have taken the meeting topics in great detail on talkofsuncity.
Jean, what a service to the community you just did. This is what SC Advocates promised to do and you did it in spades. Thank you
Well said Marco. The way she laid this meeting out was exceptional.
The $200-400 per gross square feet was for the completed building not consulting fees.
I saw that posted somewhere Farrell and i was surprised they had interpreted your comments that way. Seems to me bringing in consultants who specialize in building theaters makes sense. Probably why they aren't eh?
So what are the fees that the consultants would charge? Is there an architect in the bunch? How long will it take? What would we receive for our money?
This is just another item to add to the cost and I stand by my original statement that this is turning into a boondoggle and if constructed will be another Sun City Taj Mahal.
Seems to me those questions you are asking are spot on C de P. The problem is, no one is asking them. You know better than most, as a board member, you have a fiduciary responsibility to look at the options, not just take one opinion and make it the end game. You cited your background, which sounds to me like you considered yourself an "expert" in your field. i say that not as an insult, but the fact is, people specialize in given areas. Tapping into those experts has always been a logical next step.
While serving as a trustee on a trust fund with hundreds of millions of dollars to invest, we had any number of financial advisors to turn to. We didn't rely on one and in fact, we had other experts to help analyze the information they gave us. Ultimately we had to make a decision, but it was made on having the best information available.
If you look back at the RCSC, the actions by the gm, the asst gm and all of the projects they engaged in, how many times did they have a diversity of opinions? And how often did they have one opinion they just took as right, presented it to the board and they passed it?
Bill, I don’t consider myself an expert which I have found during my career the kiss of death. Let’s just say I highly specialized skill set which to my surprise are relevant to the goings on.
I guess my biggest complaint about SCA is you are discussing topics which SCA has little or no knowledge. The key most of your situations is financial. Until you you are familiar with financial statements and a working knowledge of analysis you are as my Home Office underwriter used say, “ you are farting into the wind.”
I am more than happy to educate SCA on this along with heavy construction, but I have a lot on my plate at the moment so I will have to advise you when I have the time.
As for Lifelong Learn I have a rough outline of a talk I would like to do titled “ What does the Black Death and the COVID 19 pandemic have in common.” More than you think.
No interest in debating the difference between experts and people who consider themselves "highly specialized" C de P. That's just semantics.
I will take offense to your comments regarding the RCSC financials. Pretending people don't understand balance sheets is nonsense. With that said, there are aspects that become fuzzy, but when you add carryover to the tune of 10 plus million dollars over a 10 year period plus set aside 5 million dollars in the reserve account, the totals speak for themselves.
Then compound it all by not investing $12 in a technology infrastructure that is sheer junk, it's freaking embarrassing. On top of all that, as a former board member, did you ever look at the form 990's? If not the last 12 years are available on this site. Here's the kick in the teeth, 25 million dollars from the yearly general ledger account to subsidize golf over the past 12 years. To be clear, i'm not talking about the 50 million from the PIF account.
Not to be unkind, but the Sun City Advocates weren't elected to make sure how the money was spent. That was why we elected board members and my guess is most of them were even more clueless than what you are accusing the Advocates of. Or, if not clueless and they knew what was going on with golf, it might well be a breach of their fiduciary obligations.
Well said Bill.
C. de P. your comment is truly unique. You claim to not be an expert (so why talk?) then advise that you could train SCA on the subject (who wants training from one of questionable competence?) and close with "I do not have the time but call me later". Are you kidding? Is this a joke? A provocateur? Surely a waste of time for all people intent in learning what's going on and
attempting to re-establish some responsible management to RCSC. But thanks for the input.
Let's get real here...anybody who knows who C. de P. is understands that his main purpose in life is to attempt to prove that anything you say is wrong and only HE knows what's right.
He has been so argumentative in the past on other blog sites that he was banned from making comments!
And of course he would be happy to educate the Advocates because he knows everything...but wait a minute...didn't he also say he wasn't an expert?
C. de P. loves to hear himself talk and we're just encouraging him to do so by responding.
Let's just hope his expertise is applied to his committee assignments! (sarcasm of course)
OK Tom I get it. You are still pissed that we decided to close our meetings to non- committee members. So evidently it is time for the deep state conspiracy to cover our work and apparently anything the RCSC does.
You are correct that I said I was not an expert but I do have a very good skill set in many areas.
Let’s take financial statements for example. Management says there is the loss carry forward of X amount of dollars and you accept what they say. So where is it exactly is it at the moment and how much? Management states that is under the heading of cash and cash equivalents. But that figure being large you really do not know how is cash as opposed to the cash forward. They say it is not used for day to day operations but since the two are not separated how do you know, you do not. Cash carry forward you be listed as a restricted asset separate from operational cash. I called them out on this and the response was that the computer program is unable to do this. pleeeeeeease. Bet you did not know this about the cash and cash carry forward. If analysis like this was a large part of your career you would. By the way, the CPAs that do the FYE statement are complicit in this nonsense.
Then there is work in process, another category you do not know what represents. Am I getting through to you Skippy? How about you Bill?
So you walk around with your copy of Robert’s Rules of Order like Charlton Heston bringing down the Ten Commandments to the Hebrews. I will continue my quest to have an accurate financial information presented to the members that everyone can understand.
By the way, a blogger who allegedly banned me from his site recruited me for my current committee assignment because of my skill set. Ain’t karma a bitch?
How about me C de P (why are we continuing with the charade btw?) Do i know where we are with work in process or cash carry forward or cash equivalents? Nope, as you noted, none of that is explained or even shows up in the financials. What i do know is at the end of each year is the balance in the cash reserves and what i do know is from Dec of 2009 to Dec of 2021 they had added to their cash reserves 10 million dollars (7 million to 17 million dollars). On top of that they had set up and reached their 5 million dollar cash reserve (rainy day fund) which now sits at 5.5 million dollars.
The point was never about having the cash on hand, the point always was the cash they did accumulate should have been spent on the items this community needed. We've been telling the RCSC their technology has sucked for the past 12 years (at least). You know that, every board knew that and everyone just let it go because they had to be loyal to the corporation.Actually, because the GM had zero interest. Oh wait, we all got ipads.
On top of that, now that we have the 990's in hand, we know they have subsidized golf to the tune of 25 million dollars in the past 12 years. That could have built one hell of a theater and we wouldn't be looking at the boondoggle at Mountainview. Virtually no accountability at all.
Finally, i don't care who serves on the committee to rewrite the bylaws. I care about the outcome. I care that we restore Sun City to a place where those living here have a voice, some say in what goes on. A place where board members don't get fired because the question or challenge the GM's decisions. A place where hiding anything from the membership is considered foolishness.
--"By the way, a blogger who allegedly banned me from his site recruited me for my current committee assignment because of my skill set. Ain’t karma a bitch?"--
Yup, and neither one of you ever admit when you're wrong...Birds of a feather...
Well Tom, I am not trying to get into some sort of food fight with you, but I think the Prevagen isn’t working. A couple of years ago in a letter to the Independent I wrote something which you pointed out was incorrect. I subsequently wrote that you were correct and I apologized. Consequently, saying that I am always right and never admit I am wrong is patently untrue. So much for that.
Bill, the by-law review committee is working very hard to get it right. Not everyone will be pleased but working to for balance with members is more difficult than you think.
As for firing a Board member because of challenging the GM over financial statements is a bit of a stretch for me as I think there is more to that situation. I battled Jan over financial statements for about ten years on and off the Board and was never separated involuntarily from the Board. So what’s the real story behind this. BTW, still arguing with management over statements. After all you said I was a numbers guy.
CdeP: You introduced into this discussion the Bylaws Committee. In a different thread, you accused Tom M of "breaking the rules" because he reported on his observations of the initial open meeting. I asked you a question that you didn't answer:
"If the meeting is open, then all 35,000 Members can attend and hear what is being said. How is that different than 1 person attending and then telling the other 34,999? There is no such thing as "what is said in this room stays in this room" in an open meeting."
Can you answer my simple question?
And I can't really figure out what you are trying to say regarding Reserve Funds - I have a problem with them growing by over 10 million dollars over a period of time when things were needed. Do you have a problem with that or not ???
My bad David, tired of typing your screen name. By know everyone should now who you are, and frankly it helps your credibility. So you know, the board member that was fired i am talking about is Barbara Brehm who was let go in 2020. She had been on the board for less than a year. She had requested the financials from Bill Cook, who also gave her the audited notes which are sometimes more valuable than the audited statements.
Anyway, after reading them, she contacted a couple of the board members and started raising questions about them. Apparently some of the board members felt that she wasn't being loyal to the "corporation." In truth, she was doing what she was elected to do; oversight. Apparently there were questions similar to the ones you broached. The board responded by firing her.
Barbara has left Sun City but i have spent a fair amount of time on the phone with her. Her background was in property management which included a substantial amount of work with the financials. Like you, she found issues. Unlike you, she wasn't trying to fix it over a ten year period. Nope, not being critical, just pointing out why you survived and she got kicked off the island.
You've said it several times now, i've said it, others have questioned how the books were done and over the 15 years, it was never fixed. If anything, it got worse. Now the new gm, even with his book keeping back ground is still playing the game. What will it take to just do it right? When will we admit how golf was handled was wrong? When will someone own up to the absolute shit pile we were left with regarding our technology and that it was "no one's fault."
The carry forward. carry over, "help me sleep good at night" nonsense isn't how anyone does their books. The good news is, the money is there to fix the problems we are facing, the bad news is the track on getting there will be too slow, too little too late.
Bill, I prefer to be called Dave as David is what Mom and/or Dad called me before discipline was coming.
As for Barbra, I really didn’t know her and all the info I had was what I heard. From my limited perspective the reason just didn’t sound correct, hence what I said. So enough of that.
As for the expert thing, in finances I consider a CPA an expert on financial statements. I spent thirty years analyzing statements during my career and knew nothing about them when I was hired, but my company taught through various seminars. My fellow underwriters also taught me as well agents and brokers I had relationships with. I was originally hired for my legal experience as we had agents in the local courthouse. I couldn’t build a road, bridge, school or any type of structure but I visited hundred of job sites so I know a few things about construction and a lot from RFB to Certificate of Occupancy.
Moving on. I have been looking in depth at the 2019 and 2020 FYE statements for RCSC and found something very curious. Aside from dropping dead, what if I told you golf has been profitable in the past, the loss comes from intangible accounting razzle dazzle on the statement? You do not see this on the monthly statement which is crap. You will see it at the end of the year, maybe on quarterly statements. The bandits are administrative expenses and depreciation. In 2019 golf represented 19% of RCSC total revenue but assigned 42% of total depreciation and 46% of total administrative expenses. In 2020, golf represented 25.6% of total revenue yet was assigned 44% of total depreciation and 44% of total administrative expenses. Golf’s “gross profit” after deducting salary and wages in 1019 was $2.11 million and in 2020 it was $2.85 million. Then the Kansas City Shuffle with intangibles we’re added which caused a paper loss. You were correct, I am a numbers guy and still would like to share my knowledge with SCA when I am available.
Bill, since Christine did not bother to explain WHY 40+% of depreciation and admin expense were allocated to golf, from your encyclopedic sources of RCSC info and history, can you explain the basis for the allocation? I suspect it is by some CPA/FASB rule applicable to golf properties, or is it just for meanness to make golf look bad (that does not seem to be the inclination of RCSC)? Thanks
You are spot on Marco and I cannot answer that question. I can say that several years ago Jan decided to start splitting up the G & A expense to each business unit which is an exhibit in the FYE F/S. What her formulary was exactly I admit I do know not as during my career we had Home Office bean counters who would notify us of changes in GAAP rules. I do know a CPA and will show that person the exhibit and maybe she’d some light on this. My chili burrito feeling (will explain that in the future) tells me employee count may be involved.
Depreciation is a different story as there is a standard for various items, ie, buildings, fixtures, vehicles, etc. There is also excelerated depreciation but that doesn’t seem to be the case in the instant matter.That schedule is contained in the Notes, but as to what was purchased and what business unit the statement is silent. All I can say is that in 2020 over $6.5 million was spent on property and equipment and your guess is as good as mine. The statements are also on an accrual basis.
One last thought on Barbara, why would Bill Cook just supply her with the notes without the front part (the numbers) unless she already had info?Just a little to much weirdness on this one that does add up in my mind, but we live in weird times.
Deus vult eam.
Marco, I can't answer your question, i doubt anyone can (other than the GM that set it up. Our financials are a closely guarded process that i would be stunned if even the Finance Committee could answer. There have been critics over the years and when push came to shove, nothing has changed. As board members our biggest concern was, would there be an increase on the lot assessments? It was the wrong way to think about it but if there was no increase, the members were happy.
I have no interest in the debate over depreciation. Capital purchases of equipment are reduced in value and as a nonprofit the question isn't all that relevant. You know as well as i it is simply a way to value the equipment over it's usable life. I would be stunned if the equipment the RCSC buys is factored into the cost of a round of golf in any way.
Which leads me to ask the question Dave, have you ever looked at the 990's the RCSC files yearly? If not you should, then we can continue the discussion whether golf makes a profit or loses money.
Bill, to answer your question, yes and no. Not to fudge my answer but I did review what was posted but really did not get in the weeds with them. If I am not mistaken they were completed by RCSC under Jan’s purview. So I have my jar of French Sea Salt handy when I give them a closer look. I do what to say that I am not familiar with this form and mostly dealt with school district financials although a non profit a different statement altogether. I also have some experience with government pension fund statements but the bonds that were required were such an amount that several sureties participated in layers and the real heavy lifting was done by Home Office underwriters for reinsurance purposes.
Now you know why I didn’t say I was an expert but had a skill set.
Bill and Christine, I beg to differ. Depreciation is far from irrelevant even for a non-profit. Its purpose in
accounting (even if it has no tax impact) is to reflect wear and tear that will eventually demand maintenance and, with equipment, replacement. Real property requires it to reflect (prepare for) forthcoming repair costs (e.g. redo of Riverview golf course a few years ago, or replacement/reconstruction/re-invention of Mountain View and redo of Lakeview). Just because we can levy fees on owners enough to set aside millions and have funds fro replacements, it is no excuse for bad accounting on this subject. The CPAs that audit RCSC books (one has to hope there is such audit) should, correction MUST be able to explain depreciation expense and accumulated depreciation thereof and how it relates to professional accounting standards.
Disclosure: I am not a CPA, I was a banker and financial investor and have been around enough CPAs to warrant an educated guess - ready to be corrected.
Didn't mean to minimize the depreciation issue Marco, my bigger concern is with Dave's suggestion golf was profitable based on the depreciation. We know from the 990's the RCSC lists golf as a stand alone category and we also know they show significant deficits on a yearly basis. When the courses were purchased for $10 and a cup of coffee (literally) the agreement between the RCSC and DEVCO was they would be revenue neutral. The fear was they would become a money pit (which they have).
I've never argued much about the 50 million dollar investment from the PIF, it's the 25 million dollars used to subsidize them from the general revenue account they've spent over the last 12 years. Unless and until they can show me their purchase of agreements on equipment and that it was billed back to golf, the questions about how the equipment is depreciated is irrelevant to the discussion.
My bigger concern is going forward. The ADWR 5th management plan due in 2025 has an enormous price tag attached to it with a staggering 8 million dollar price tag to convert the South course to desert landscaping (and that's at today's prices).
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